14 Month Old Boy Out Door Training - HELP!

[Hunter396]

Hi everyone, 

Firstly please be kind in the replies I am feeling so delicate and I know what I am about to say may be upsetting for some people. 

Today I had my first thought of "maybe we made a mistake"

For background - we have had our lad for nearly a year now and have consistently worked on training, setting boundaries and creating the right routine for us and our lad. We took him to puppy classes which helped a huge amount with his training and socialising and we continue to train for at least 30 minutes a day. Now at 14 months our lad is a star at home, rarely causes issues and responds extremely well to a number of commands. 

Now onto our lad outside - he pulls a lot which we know is normal, loves to scavenge and loves any opportunity to be on his long line. He gets around 2 hours of walks a day alongside his training and playing at home. This is 30 minutes in the morning before we go to work, 30 minutes midday with a dog walker then an hour in the evening with either myself or my partner. At the weekends we can take him out for upwards of 4 hours a day depending on where we got etc. 

Over the past couple of months, whilst out he has become increasingly reactive to other dogs and this can be dogs 500 metres away or a dog across the road - he seems to see them and go mad not matter what the distance. He will yank, go up onto his back legs and the only way I can describe it is shout! We have reached a stage where we have to avoid him meeting other dogs because he jumps on them or the owner because he is so over excited to see them - I know this is probably the worst thing we could do but I have no idea what else we can do - he is so strong I am worried that I won't be able to control him one day and he will hurt another dog or their owner (he is never ever ever aggressive and is so soft at home with us and guests). so my first question is what to do training wise to help with that? Secondly any tips for pulling? We have a halti gentle leader which worked for about 2 weeks but he has gone back to yanking and I am worried he will seriously hurt himself and we also have a belt which I use when we are out in fields but since its dark earlier we have had to walk on pavements and in our village the paths are so narrow we can't use the belt as we would have zero control. We have also tried treats to get him to walk next to/on a looser lead but he ignores even his favourite treats of chicken or cheese because he is so excited. 

I took him out this evening for what I was hoping would be an hour but after 15 minutes I just burst into tears and took him home as quickly as possible. I feel like I am at my wits end and walking him is no longer a nice experience, I actually dread it. Feeling like we have made a mistake getting him has upset me even more - I love him to pieces but I can't help feeling like we have let him down by not being better with his walking training. 

thank you for taking the time to read this! 

 

[2Huskyfun]

Welcome.

You have come to the right place! Everyone here will be able to help in some way.

I personally completely understand. My girl is the best on the lead. No issues with her what so ever, even when the boy is at his worst. She will just set and wait until I am done dealing with her brother’s  shenanigans.

My boy (turning 10 months) is doing the exact same thing. Can be so awesome until we get in sight of another dog or even walk by a house with a dog barking. Jumps 4feet straight up, screams, has started a new thing we’re he runs backwards on my. Does not matter if I have treats, ignored commands, and it is frustrating!

I really cannot give advice because I cannot even get mine to knock it off.

*funny thing is...They are brother sister. I trained him and his sister the exact same way, at the same time, together and she is golden girl and he is a monster. What works for one may not work for the other*

Your not alone! I will be watching the responses and be trying them too. Don’t give up. 

[2Huskyfun]

This is what I have been doing. Well, not exactly how I was doing it and it may be my issues. But I think it is a great training concept.

[petertmartin]

This sounds like Harlow she's perfect to walk at times then other days she'll be lunging at dogs or trying to get closer to them. It's really annoying but never malicious I know she's just super excited to see a dog she wants to playing with. They all have their own personalities and I think some of us are just unlucky to get a husky that acts a particular way when others don't. We too have tried everything from food to toys to get her to walk next to us when another dog is around and it can work maybe 50/50 but we know we can never sit at a dog cafe or pub like other people do. Continue training because they do calm down (ours is 2 and has calmed a bit, I found around 12 -14 months was actually a real struggle with behaviour issues)

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[Rachael_Astro]

I would definitely recommend getting a behaviourist to come out on walks with you. They will be able to see exactly what is happening and why, they will be able to explain things from your dogs point of view and tell you what you need to do. Where abouts are you? I’ve had a behaviourist come out to me before and he was so helpful! The one I had specialises in aggression, he works with the local rescue with dogs with aggression problems so they can be rehomed. Maybe contact your local rescues to see if they can recommend anyone?


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[BingBlaze n Skyla]

I found a walkyourdogwithlove non pull harness helped train mine to walk nicely , do you know anyone with calm friendly dogs you can meet up to give him exposure, I'm not sure if you've had him since a pup but it sounds like he's been under socialised with other dogs

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[2Huskyfun]

Well, my pride and joy perfect little girl that I was just bragging about.....

She broke loose from her collar and it was off to the races!!! 45 minutes of pure  terror for me and 45 minutes of her having the time of her life! 

I don’t think she has ever smiled so big.

Thank God I had the boy double hooked and it kept her in the neighborhood and from not running out onto a major high traffic area and to were my neighbors way down the street were able to corner her in a garage. 

Got her home, loved on both of them, cried, and spent money on harnesses and collars. LOL

 

[Hunter396]

23 hours ago, BingBlaze n Skyla said:

I found a walkyourdogwithlove non pull harness helped train mine to walk nicely , do you know anyone with calm friendly dogs you can meet up to give him exposure, I'm not sure if you've had him since a pup but it sounds like he's been under socialised with other dogs

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Hey yes we have had him since a pup and regularly walk him with my partners jack russell and spaniel - he gets on really well with other dogs when we do meet them its just the initial over excitedness that is  concern 

23 hours ago, Rachael_Astro said:

I would definitely recommend getting a behaviourist to come out on walks with you. They will be able to see exactly what is happening and why, they will be able to explain things from your dogs point of view and tell you what you need to do. Where abouts are you? I’ve had a behaviourist come out to me before and he was so helpful! The one I had specialises in aggression, he works with the local rescue with dogs with aggression problems so they can be rehomed. Maybe contact your local rescues to see if they can recommend anyone?


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Thankfully aggression isn't an issue with him just him not knowing his own strength and getting over excited - I will see if we can find a local trainer thanks or the advice  

20 minutes ago, 2Huskyfun said:

Well, my pride and joy perfect little girl that I was just bragging about.....

She broke loose from her collar and it was off to the races!!! 45 minutes of pure  terror for me and 45 minutes of her having the time of her life! 

I don’t think she has ever smiled so big.

Thank God I had the boy double hooked and it kept her in the neighborhood and from not running out onto a major high traffic area and to were my neighbors way down the street were able to corner her in a garage. 

Got her home, loved on both of them, cried, and spent money on harnesses and collars. LOL

 

Oh no I bet that was terrifying! Glad you got her back!

[Maz51]

I took on Blu (16 months old) on Nov 25, 2018. It is a formal foster 'trial' agreement & an open period, to give his owner time to decide what to do or, if he can change his working hours.

He is a lively,  HuskyxMal, spent a lot more time in his 12' x 6' kennel as his owner was discovering, with increasing work hours creeping up so that a nine to ten hour day was becoming 12 to 14 hours.  Even with someone to let him out or take for a walk, this was causing growing concern for quality of life by Blu's owner.  Blu has a lovely nature, is extremely affectionate and still puppyish when & how he seeks to be really close to you, like, lying across your lap, neck, chest or burrowing half under you.  And falling asleep. 

So Blu's owner found me on fb and asked if would I take him.

He didn't want Blu to go the pound, shelter or rescue route.

I had a serious chat with hubby;  he's known for a few years I wanted another to join my two, and in Sep 2017, had built for me the back run, shelters  (😉 x four) on decking, with covered wired overhang to prevent houdini jump outs), gates x two (I paid for the extra one opposite patio area) for access on to lawn, and gravelled, plus a patio decking area (south facing), reinforced fencing & panelled all along our side incl rein forced fencing for the weight, (neighbour had already had this side completely replaced from back to front (about 130'). This provides a long run to the back, a very large area within the run and with hayfilled roomy dry shelters for large dogs like HuskyXMals or Malamutes.

The four shelter block can be moved with three/four strong men, and the base is open, so straw lies on the decking; this also provides ventilation from under through very slim gaps on the decking, plus drainage. My five year dream came true - we took out a small loan with a bit extra, to also cover some redecoration for indoors.

This year David oiled all the woodwork as recommended & can redo this every two- three years. 

Chester is now 6.3yrs & came aged nine weeks, & Eski came (@2.1/12 after my Westies passed aged 13.5+ yrs & 15.5+ yrs old and Chester pined horribly.

My girl Polly had adopted him - and was an extremely good mum, as she had been to five litters; all my pups never left until min 12-14 weeks old.  (What mum teaches them in manners, toilet training, behaving nice socially & being friendly, is priceless). We made a good team!

Eski came from Gumtree, as a rehome, rescue after her lady pensioner owner died suddenly in hospital, and her daughter felt it unfair to keep her indoors with an hour's dog walker a day, after six months.  Besides, she knew little about huskies, or their care.

Eski ticked all the right boxes, and our first meet was outside our home.  Eski was two weeks post spay, (one of my conditions prior), as Chester was still intact but due to be neutered at two yrs or just over, which was the week after Eski came!  They got on well and, she stayed. He went in two days prior his 2nd birthday for muffinballs to be emptied after 48 hrs of trying to stop him hurting Eski by humping.. (both ends).

Eski came with food guarding, possession and, we found jealousy issues.  Serious issues - we had some really sudden unprovoked attacks.

Poor Chester who is as soft as butter would sit back with a 'wtf-inghell was THAT about?!" look on his face.

So, he got snipped, & both were in cones; he mastered the hang of going out the dog flap backwards ( but not coming in), and Eski just acted totally blonde.

I started serious training, after earlier researching (with just Chester then) -  & found:                           ● Successdogs.com - ordered a DVD too & rewatched several times his free e-book & the MO behind his, Jean Cote's, ethos, on Lure, Capture, Reward.   (● THESE THREE POINTS are  the most important part to understand and implement, so do not skip it!) ... and this I had started on with Chester.

After a few weeks, with several 3 to 5 minute sessions, Chester had mastered to ignore anything on the floor, and 'watch me'.  He also learned to 'Leave' (or 'Give' something back) & only go and fetch that treat on the floor on my 'Ok'.  He then learned to pick stuff up, stand on a piece of paper, and later an upturned low plant barrell, circle round it with fore feet on it, hind legs moving, and to 'fetch/pick it up,'  items off the floor and bring to me and .. then learned to drop it into my hands first, then a bowl, but then into a bowl on the floor.  When he got it wrong, silence, only hand gestures to/from item/to bowl. He got a reward every 'right' time with an ecstatic 'Yes! Good boy! Fetch & bring!'  Then he learned to pick up (fetch') his metal 'bowl' and bring it to me into my hands.  Dogs don't  seem to like metal in their mouths, so this took longer, but he cracked it.  

I tried with Eski, but she became very gobby & vocal and remained a 'blondie'!

Through all both their training - daily - I reward the good, ignore the bad/wrongs by treat or big praise..

They have 'time out' in a separate room or told 'go to bed' or 'out' (of the room), if being naughty or unpleasant, including getting over active or, playful indoors.

The bungalow is compact and too small for this and there's three times more space outside in the back to run. 

So, Eskie got sorted to now  being 95% improved on all her issues. We don't leave any food or bones down, and minimal toys, ie, the ones she isn't interested in, like balls! They stay in the garden.

Chester is a soft wuss but can be a total ass-0.. too.

They both learned to spin to 'Gee' & 'Haw'indoors, prior to my rig. Which I saved nearly a year for, plus all musher commands during walking out in a two dog gangline in harness.

I want to teach Blu too.  He had no social manners around my two, or us.

One single good kind owner so it wasn't his fault. He also paced.. and paced and paced (still does, but is decreasing this now) and this caused friction as he'd push past mine in the doorway, or walk on/over them!

I started the first night he came home.  A 90+ minute journey. Dogs came in, and  all three were muzzled, and were all told 'to bed'. Once they'd quietened down after a run in the garden, I then removed muzzles.

Blu had a crate of ours with his blanket in & just one, of his many soft chewed up toys. My two know the dinner routine.

Blu went 'to bed' and finally did go into 'down'.  I started preparing dinner. Bowls out on counter. Blu was up and came into kitchen.  I told him "Blu, Bed, Down" & walked him back by gesture to his crate, and gestured with finger sweep down to lie in " down".    Dinner prep is usually three plus minutes: bowls out, coconut oil (one tspn off fork) first, Kefir 2tblspn each bowl, ACV 1 tspn each bowl (once daily only) & part raw (or raw mince) food off the shelf or from fridge if opened, mashed with fork, then 80ml scoop of Xcel 32% kibble added.   Stir, add a cup of water, stir and place these in their respective adjustable raised dbl bowl stands.

It took 30 minutes with Blu .. who was up and taken back quietly to his crate... fourteen times.  [[My two were (incredibly good. And quiet too!]] ...   By day four, he'd cracked it. He might be up, once, now rarely, pacing into kitchen, then back to his bed.  Dinner prep now takes four minutes.  My two are now noisiest, and Chester will creep in when my back is turned! If they start howling (Blu's just finding his voice) I stop. They're  learning, lol. 

I invested in using vibration/sound only collars (E-collars are illegal in UK now & I had to immobile the 'E' part on these.  They only be'eep, or vibrate.  

I have applied them to my neck.  It's not painful, just distracting, & can make my throat vibrate! depending on level (1-100 for vibrate) and if on at right 'tighness' with room for two flat fingers under, these do distract them enough to get them listening during great excitenent or reaction.

I work on verbal commands first; if that's ignored then I use the be-eep; if that is ignored then I go to vibrate and this is the system I use : verbal first then the beep then vibrate and if they continue to ignore, the vibrate gets stronger. Because I started at level 40 they now react positively to level 60 to 80 between them.

By day four, Chester was out if his muzzle. By day 11 muzzles were off for day time whilst I was around, with collars on Eski (#1) & Blu (#2).

I supervised all play times. If it got silly, or Blu caused too much pushing/jumping around to make Eski go for him, both had muzzles back on immediately. They learnt fast.  It is not new to Eski !

By day 15, Eski started playing flirtatiously with Blu! After 4.5 years of a snarly very 'dog reactive' girl (apart from some nice times at husky camps) this was fab.

I had them run zoomies daily, before taking them all on walks. Six stone each = 18 stone pulling power! Canibelts, locking (used by climbers) carabiners extea necklines to/from extra collar, ▪▪Dogmatic ( the best for me), head collars, +necklines linked to harnesses & to leads.

They all walk well - two miles with stops for me - (I have chronic neck pain) and by day 16, I could leave all indoors, unmuzzled, and being good.

Bread & anything edible gets moved away into the oven or into the microwave if they chew their bedding that's their problem (altho' no issues now with strong, canvas/waterproof dog beds @ £19.99 each, which I may replace every two years.  They are wash a ble, just use a hairdryer to dry out the inside .. and they ste asm lol.  Chester is very good at picking anything up from outside and bringing it back indoors for me.  

I pick up once or twice daily &  freshwater into very large 2QT/3QT bowls outside the back door, and they have 24/7 access to outside.  

I apologise this is so long ... but, I felt I have needed to explain how I train, how long I train, and how often I train (every day for every treat) and this is an ongoing thing ... everyday. 😂

We still get some snaps from Eski and even Chester or Blu if either of the other ones come in for a fuss as well, but they all know now that behaviour like this is not acceptable and they are sent outside or taken out to their bed and they will spend five minutes 'time out' in the crate with the door shut.  I only have to say 'be nice or you go out?' and now they comply.

No it's not perfect; no, I would never trust them around food without supervision with Eski particularly, but I'm happy now it's working and.                  "success dogs.com" has been priceless in teaching ME how to understand the "Lure Capture, Reward Ethos" that gets the dogs to do what I ask them to do, to them wanting to please me for that treat.

Good Luck.  

Their vibrate/sound collars are only on now when they go out on walks or trips.

Peace reigns 98%, indoors &vout in the garden, so I am ever watchful esp. indoors, as space is pretty tight lol.

Day 17 - I took them all out into town by car. This was a new experience for Blu and he ended up sitting behind my chair outside Costas where I had met a friend (having been pretty house bound for 17 days), and he sat and just watched the foot traffic, the road traffic, the noise & the bustle ..with treats and commands to 'sit' or 'down' as and when appropriate; he did get a bit excited when other dogs came past as Eskie, does but they all ended up behaving practically 85% very well. I was very proud of him and proud of my two and of course they attracted a hell of a lot of attention by passers by, because they're all gorgeous looking furkids.. 😁 

I am having built I hope by bro-in-law a two tier of four inside crates (of the last pic), with gunge hinge/pin doors to remove when not required. They seem to all share beds, so they'll have four to choose from! Maybe next year I will board another on hols, altho' outside is also ideal for those that can &  do live outside. 

Oh the sepia pucs are some if my childhood and many other animals on the farm in Borneo.  My background story is on my FB page xx

End. 

 

[chelseafan]

I feel for you, I had a similar issue with one of my boys Luka blue, I saw a behaviourist as my training didn’t work, she gave me some great advice. On a walk carry some tiny treats with you and when a dog approaches and your boy starts to get excited scatter some treats to the side of you in a grassy area if you can and let him find them, it’s purely a distraction technique and keeps your boy from becoming too excited. You could also turn around and walk in the opposite direction if he’s too excited, the behaviourist explained that once they reach a certain point of excitement it becomes too difficult for them to calm down without removing them from the situation. It does work but consistency is key, and lots of praise when he’s calm, and not forgetting he’s still a pup really, he’s still learning. The other bit of important advice she gave me is to stay calm and take control, not aggressively, when giving him commands and lots of praise when he gets it right, he will pick up on your negative feelings. If he likes playing with a ball you could carry one in your other hand, just hold it to keep him distracted, it’s what you can find that’ll work for you.
As for head collars, have a look on Indi dog, they’re much softer on the snout and fasten at the back of the head so no pulling their head around. Good luck, we’ve had our moments but it really is finding what works for you and consistent training.


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[wolfpup]

I know how you feel  -  On his own  Lunar (13) is the perfect dog to walk  - when he sees another dog he goes into avoidance mode   -  however when Marley (3) is with us he is all  "You wanna piece of me?   Bring it on"!     Marley is very excitable anyway  -  up on his back legs, leaping  etc   -  no agression whatsoever, he just wants to play  -  no sense either   - has had me over more than once.  I have Marley on Walk-your-dog-with-love harness  - and since then he has not had me over  - but it is difficult to handle him with the double lead and Lunar together.

I would try a behavourist as @Rachael_Astro mentioned.

[rocksandcatsx]

Hi,

I've just added a husky puppy to my life too and boy is it a handful! Its nice reading everyone's experiences and how exciting owning one is. I wasn't sure where to post but if anyone is keen or aware of any local dog meets for puppies besides puppy pre school i'm really interested in going. 

-

Sophie.

[Maz51]

Where are you based?

I'm near J9 M5.

Maz