cookiemonster Posted November 3, 2010 Report Share Posted November 3, 2010 Not sure whats happening with Logan but he seems to be getting worse at sleeping in his crate, it only took us a few days to get him used to it and after a week he was sleeping 8 hours a night which we thought was too good to be true... and now i think it might be lol Logan is now 12 weeks old and for the last 3/4 nights hes been a nightmare and has been howling for hours at random times for no reason at all and im wondering what could have possibly changed to do this, but there really isnt anything we are doing differently. Ill explain the routine we have always done and if you guys can see any problem areas please let me know! We feed him at 8:30am 12pm 5:30pm and 9:30pm, with me walking him at 8:30pm for 15 minutes, hes also walked at lunch time for about 15-20 mins and we let him have a run around in the garden in the mornings. After his food we normally turn out all the lights in the bedroom and kitchen and have the tv on low to help him settle with him normally slouched beside the couch in the lounge with us, by about 10:30pm we go to bed and i pick him up bring him into the kitchen and ask him to go to his crate. Now before he was going inside on his own because he was sleepy, i normally place a toy inside that he hasnt seen in a while to keep him occupied if he does wake up and this was working great with him sleeping right through until 7am. Then his routine changed slightly in that when i put him in his crate he would stay in there for roughly 10 minutes and then howl for a pee, so i went down let him out for a pee and then took some time to get him into his crate but once he was in he was sleeping through the night. Now his routine for the last few days has been when i pick him up to put him in his crate he wakes up and mouths my arm a little as if to say i dont want too, i wait until he has had a pee, then he refuse to go into his crate unless he is given a treat or i play with his toy inside the crate for a few minutes. Normally within a minute hes howling so again i let him out and he has another pee with him now being a bit agitated more mouthing and a little barking and refusing to go into his crate unless i offer a treat. Once in hes now barking and howling for a few hours before settling and then waking up at 5-6am and this morning it was 4am! so i let him out, he pees and then once in his crate again he will not settle until 7am again when hes let out. Im not going down after hes gone toilet as i know its just him wanting out and he has a very different bark between his toilet one and his annoyed one, but could there be something im doing wrong or is he just testing the water? A few things i can see when looking at the bigger picture that could be wrong. He seems to be wanting longer walks, after our 15 minutes he doesnt seem at all tired but hes only 12 weeks now so i dont want him to be over worked. Also when we let him out at 7am we normally have a cuddle on the couch for 30 mins where he sleeps a little bit more, could this be why, maybe he just prefers the couch? lol Or does he need more poitive re inforcement with his crate? Any help would be great! Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
husky princess Posted November 3, 2010 Report Share Posted November 3, 2010 He sounds bored to me, i wouldnt lengthen the walks but offer him some obediance to stimulate his brain. Enrol in a puppy class to help socialise him and offer you guidance but basically keep instructions REALLY basic - sit, down, off, paw, high 5 etc. Each time he does what you ask reward with a treat immediatly. Do this several times a day (once he's had a nap & receovered from a walk etc). I would also tidy his toys up and rotate them round (get more if you need to) so they are always interesting Also check that you not over feeding and so having more unused energy. If the guidance say 50-100g per day...offer the lower amount (food allowance to include treats). Its also worth checking the ingredients - colourings, perservatives etc may be adding energy he doesnt need !! Good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SarahNukka&Shadow Posted November 3, 2010 Report Share Posted November 3, 2010 9.30pm is very late to be feeding him and then expecting him to sleep on that and at 3 months he wont have any bladder/bowl control yet so this might be upsetting him.. treats and playtime in the middle of the night arnt really a good idea either as this is just going to ramp him up and then make him howl when you leave him! As for exercise the 15min walks just means walks you can still play with him in the house and garden or maybe walk him 15 minutes then sit out with him give him a little rest then walk back? I'd really try to cut down any nap times during the day... we got to the point where we'd actually make funny noises at Nukka when she was falling asleep during the day coz then she wouldnt sleep at night! LOL Other than that I'd deffo say you cant really do enough positive re-enforcement in the crate.. the usual stuff making it an amzing place he WANTS to be so all covered up and cozy inside with a blanket or jumper that smells of you and plenty of toys... then in the day any time he goes in the crate treat.. even feed his meals in there and give him chews in there to get him really loving it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookiemonster Posted November 3, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 3, 2010 Thanks for the advice, he currently goes to puppy class twice a week and we are constantly doing all the basic commands which he does 100% hes even got the "find it" command from inside the house to something outside the house lol We also have his toys rotated each day. Could it maybe be some seperation anxiety? Hes not on his own for more than 3 hours a day and even then we dont have him in his crate but in the kitchen area where his crate is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookiemonster Posted November 3, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 3, 2010 Thanks Sarah, ill change his meal times so he gets his last meal at 8pm and shuffle them a bit, cut the treats out and the time he gets after he pees at night aswell and go from there. Just found it weird how this schedule has suddenly gone from being great to not working as he was sleeping the whole night, not even needing to pee, until morning at 11 weeks old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daxwax Posted November 3, 2010 Report Share Posted November 3, 2010 9.30 is definitely too late for the last meal. I think you'd be best to go back to basics and make the crate a really brilliant place to be - one way to do that would be to give him his meals (all of them, if necessary!) in a Kong, stuffed in there with a bit of paste so it takes him a while to eat, and give them solely in the crate. Shut the door but stay in the room with him at first, then leave him to it and move around the house a bit, then practice leaving the house for a few seconds, coming back and walking by the crate, leaving again through a different door etc., really mix it up so he doesn't dread being put in the crate because he thinks you're leaving him for a long time. I would also put him in the crate for short periods randomly throughout the day - say if you want to hoover, or cook dinner, put him in the crate with a nice raw bone to keep him busy and ignore him for an hour. Ignore him when you let him out, you don't want him to get excited about leaving the crate, only about going in it! Never ever let him out or interact with him when he's howling - letting him out, giving him treats and playing with him is reinforcing that howling = human comes and plays with me. Puppy classes is good news, if he's not tired after a fifteen minute walk there's no reason he can't have a five minute one again right before bed, just round the block or so. Lots and lots of little five minute walks are better than one big one, especially for lead training, keeps it short and sweet and won't hurt his joints. If you do this consistently it will nip it in the bud, as a breed they are prone to separation anxiety and having had to deal with truly astonishing SA in an adult rescue sibe I can tell you that it's far better to get the routine down now rather than when they're a destructive six month old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tikaani&Aiyana Posted November 3, 2010 Report Share Posted November 3, 2010 Great advice everyone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormy Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 Dan shadow doesn't get tired on his walks he gets fifteen minutes in the morning and then again at night then right before bed will either be the garden or just a small round the block kinda thing. I don't give shadow anything at night as once the light goes out he goes straight to sleep I hear him maybe once but he doesn't make a noise and just goes back to sleep again, in the day I give shadow a kong filled with a few treats and I seal the ends with peanut butter I make it the night before and freeze it it keeps him happy for ages and because he's worked for it he is then tired and sleeps for a bit longer he also has a kong wobbler where he has to push it to get the treats out he loves that to! Worth a try we need to arrange a meet up soon!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookiemonster Posted November 5, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 Thanks for the tips guys, logans back on track, sleeping 8 hours a night again. Changed his meal times to earlier and he seems alot more comfortable. He also seemed to have a poorly tummy which is why he was waking up so much so changed to just chicken for a few days and hes all sorted. Not sure if a 5 minute walk before bed would just make him more excited, hmm might have to try and see. Storm me and sarah are going to elevedon this wkend think you could make that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormy Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 I can't I'm afraid gotta prepare to sort out my new job and because of the current one I have NO money atall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookiemonster Posted November 5, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 glad you got it sorted mate. Sure there will be another time to meet up though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stargirl Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 Glad to hear that he has settled down again, Kody used to cry at bedtime for ages in the kitchen but only in the last 4 weeks he has settled down completely , and he has now settled into sleeping outside in his kennel. All in his own time. We walk him in the morning and for about 1/2 hr before dinner in the evening which we give at the latest 8pm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookiemonster Posted November 13, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2010 well spoke too soon once again lol Hes back to the howling! Im starting to think maybe hes just not happy being in the kitchen, just recently hes been napping a bit in the lounge and even when im not in the room with him hes very happy to be there. Im thinking maybe to get him happier with the crate we should move it into the lounge and everytime hes laying down we encourage him inside? atleast that way if he does drop off hes used to it being in the crate. Its that or we continue with him in the kitchen, what do you guys think?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SarahNukka&Shadow Posted November 13, 2010 Report Share Posted November 13, 2010 well spoke too soon once again lol Hes back to the howling! Im starting to think maybe hes just not happy being in the kitchen, just recently hes been napping a bit in the lounge and even when im not in the room with him hes very happy to be there. Im thinking maybe to get him happier with the crate we should move it into the lounge and everytime hes laying down we encourage him inside? atleast that way if he does drop off hes used to it being in the crate. Its that or we continue with him in the kitchen, what do you guys think?? That sounds like a plan that way when your relaxing watching TV he can be in his crate relaxing and you can reward the relaxed behaviour more easily! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arooroomom Posted November 13, 2010 Report Share Posted November 13, 2010 Let's try to remember it's Husky puppy here! Masters of deception! As long as you're feeding him no later than 8 and taking him for a quick walk before bed, there's no real reason why he should be crying. In all honesty it just sounds like he's crying because he KNOWS you will want to do everything in your power to make him more comfortable. And in time this will create a dog who won't do anything without some serious work (or heavy treating) on your part. Cheyenne was like this as a baby but as long as she was fed early enough (we fed around 6pm when she was a baby) and had been walked before bed (normally 9-10pm) there was no real reason she needed to be crying. Now, if she was all of a sudden crying in the middle of the night, that was something totally different and we took her out of the crate with the leash, took her out for no more than 5 minutes and if nothing happened, back into the crate until morning. We also stopped the water dish around 8pm. They are pathetic little bundles when they're crying like babies, I know. But what you really don't want is to create an adult dog who "isn't comfortable" sleeping in room A or doesn't like to go to bed without B ect. ect. Because that's a real pain in the behind! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookiemonster Posted November 13, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2010 The reason for needing to change things is because i dont think he finds his crate as great a place to be as he used too. Ive never been down to comfort him and always let him howl it out, but im struggling to see, like you say why hes gone from sleeping all night to only sleeping for 2 hours. The only thing i can think of is that by us only feeding the odd meal in his crate and moving it into the kitchen from the lounge has caused him to not see it as a positive place. Thats why im unsure whether its best to go back to having it in the lounge and start the positive reinforcement again or to leave it in the kitchen but still feed his meals in it and hope he gets better again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Angel n Auroras Mum Posted November 13, 2010 Report Share Posted November 13, 2010 Storm went through this stage a while ago. we cover his crate up at night. sometimes he wakes me to go outside, somenights he goes all night. He is just testing how far he can bend the rules. stick to the routine and it should calm down eventually! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookiemonster Posted November 14, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2010 Well moved the crate into the lounge and made him sleep in it with the door open plus all his toys in there and really praised him when he was inside. Then moved it back to the kitchen where it normally is and although he howled for 30 minutes he then slept until 7:30am so although he really is unpredictable its encouraging that he can still do it if we keep the positive reinforcment going! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormy Posted November 14, 2010 Report Share Posted November 14, 2010 That's great Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renniwano Posted November 14, 2010 Report Share Posted November 14, 2010 I know this may sound really daft.. as they are Huskies we are talking about.. but Neo *although not crated* went through a few days of messed up sleep when it started to get colder at night. As much as he's happy to lay outside on the concrete after a walk/play.. We set the timer on the heating up just a little for the middle of the night *2am* and hey presto back to sleeping through.. Could he be feeling the cold a little more than usual ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookiemonster Posted November 14, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2010 hmm maybe, the cold weather does coincide with his need to howl all night. But he is a husky and always hot when hes in the lounge so i would be suprised if thats the case. Still worth a look i guess, ill try a heat pad tonight and see what happens. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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