sakora Posted April 5, 2009 Report Share Posted April 5, 2009 Hey all I was wondering if anyone here has experienced the same thing, Sakora is being........well really bitchy and strange, She's blowing her coat right now, she has eatin maybe 3cups of food in the last 2 weeks, along with treats and 2 raw bones, We went to training class and she was a big old show off, but still seems to be in a mood, The trainer even commented that sakora seemed goofy, I took her to her best friend Echo's(Belgin Sheppard) house for a play date and when he jumped on me to say hi like he always does , Sakora full out attacked him she had him by the neck and was just kicking the crap out of him, I had to grab poor echo and throw him behind me, Then she just stopped like nothing happen???? I took her home after that cause Echo was scared of her,(poor guy), Also I have to mention that I have been watching my friends rottie Enzo for a week while there away in Alaska I bring Enzo to the house to play with Sakora, I have been doing this same routine, for the last week, Sakora is happy and whines when I bring Enzo over, But Thursday she just decided that she was going to beat her up too!!! So now I have been keeping her and Enzo away from each other, I called the vet and he didnt seem worried, But I am My husband and I let her in the house everyday and now if he sits next to me or try's to give me a kiss she will jump up and squeezes in between us, She goes for her normal walks and other than those few incidents there has been no other problems,We have had Sakora for 6 moths now so I'm hoping that maybe she just depressed cause the snow is melting,and its getting warmer outside, I don't know what the hell to think!! Maybe shes mad that I have been taking care of enzo, and she can smell her on me, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BingBlaze n Skyla Posted April 5, 2009 Report Share Posted April 5, 2009 hey angie sorry i cant help shes not in heat or anything is she? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucy Posted April 5, 2009 Report Share Posted April 5, 2009 Can only suggest she is due in season??? How old is she? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sakora Posted April 5, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2009 well she just turned 2 and I was told she's fixed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucy Posted April 5, 2009 Report Share Posted April 5, 2009 umm......keep us updated and i'll put my thinking hat on! She's not hurt herself has she? Or in pain and she's just trying to protect herself? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyMukki Posted April 5, 2009 Report Share Posted April 5, 2009 it might be a dominance thing. Tala lets all the other dogs know she is alpha female, even visitors. Since I am her alpha, she will calm down if I walk over and stop her. I will hold her and allow the other dog to approach, if she gets bitchy I turn her and walk away. After a few minutes she goes away to sulk, then starts playing. Tala and Mukki had major who's the boss issues the first year -she was boss inside, he was boss outside and then he became boss all the time. I got a lot of help for that book, Siberian Husies for Idiots or Dummies, whichever LOL We used to have issues on walks but now she is pretty friendly. The turning away and not allowing contact if she was bitchy helped. That's what worked for me. Oh, almost forgot... her mood also improved when I convinced the Vet that I thought she acted like me with PMS! She was put on anti-inflamatories for 2 months and not allowed to mush -she turned into a sweety overnight! No more meds, but no more mushing either, which is okay with her! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siberian_wolf Posted April 6, 2009 Report Share Posted April 6, 2009 Sorry Angie I wouldn't really know what to say apart from maybe look in to behaviourists. Have you noticed any signs that she was starting to become aggressive before her attacking started? Are you anxious/tense when you meet certain dogs? Thats what I found with Gizmo, when we met another dog that was bouncing towards us I would become anxious and hold Gizmo on a short leash and then he would pick on my feelings and so would take charge of the situation (plus he was attacked by another dog when he was a puppy) and protect himself by growling and showing dominant body language toward the other dogs. Since Ive become alot more relaxed in these situations Gizmo has been great with other dogs and will happily say hello. If you see a good behaviourist, they shall be able to inform you of weather Sakora is being Dominant or Fearful aggressive and will be able to help you and sakora overcome the situation. Sorry, but thats all I can think of. Keep us updated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bec Posted April 6, 2009 Report Share Posted April 6, 2009 If there are no apparent health issues with her (and by all means get the vet to check her out if you are worried) I would step up the NILIF principle. There are things you can do to increase her food drive too - how long do you leave food down for her if she doesn't eat it? You need to remind her that nothing in life is free. Dominant or bossy behaviour does not fly in this house, a dog displaying such behaviour towards me or other people here would be ignored, or put away from us and the other dogs (when they exhibit the behaviour). If she is jumping up/squeezing in or generally demanding attention from you do not let her get away from it! Do not give in to her and give her attention or let her up on the lounge etc. For some dogs, even a verbal punishment (i.e. saying "no!" or "ah ah!") is a positive because they are viewing it as being successful in getting attention. Teach her that she is not to get on the furniture without your ok. She is not to get anything - food, attention, pats, toys, treats etc - without 'paying for it' first. Make her sit, stay, down - give a known command in order to teach her that she doesn't get something for nothing, because you control the resources. And on your terms only - you don't have to engage with her every time she brings a toy over or wants a pat. She has to earn the rewards. I would be particularly strict with any dog that is being dominant and pushing the boundaries. By all means find a qualified and reputable behaviourist in your area to assess her. This will be especially useful when dealing with her behaviour towards other dogs. A good behaviourist will teach you what signs to look out for so you can preempt her before she attacks or dominates another dog. You will learn to read the cues she is giving so you can tell when she is uncomfortable or when she is about to 'strike'. For the mean time I would take back control and restrict interactions with other dogs, always keep her on leash even around the dogs she knows so that you can easily reel her in if she becomes too rough. Work on getting her focus on you when she is around other dogs so that you can get her attention back easily if it wanes. Amy - I would generally agree that our behaviour around other dogs can affect how our dogs reacts, tension can certainly be transferred from one end of the leash to another etc. However, from what the OP described, Sakora is reacting to dogs she knows and has played with well in the past. There could be a variety of reasons for her change in behaviour - she could have been giving out cues or more subtle signals before that owners often miss, that indicated something was not right or was making her uncomfortable. However, it could also be rank aggression (quite uncommon, but more commonly seen in dog/dog relations than dog/human relations) which is where a dog aggresses towards others because it is acting out of over confidence. I would definitely recommend seeking the assistance of a behaviourist but also look at how you are interacting with Sakora on a day to day basis, and how strong her relationship is with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siberian_wolf Posted April 6, 2009 Report Share Posted April 6, 2009 fantastic information Bec, added to rep I see your point with sakora becoming aggressive with dogs she has previously played with, which is where I became 'baffled' as not heared of that before. Just though would mention about Gizmo's aggression/behaviour and how I over come it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bec Posted April 6, 2009 Report Share Posted April 6, 2009 fantastic information Bec, added to rep I see your point with sakora becoming aggressive with dogs she has previously played with, which is where I became 'baffled' as not heared of that before. Just though would mention about Gizmo's aggression/behaviour and how I over come it. And it was great info! I was just wondering (and it is near impossible to tell without seeing the situation IRL) that it might be something a bit different, showing that sort of behaviour towards known dogs can mean something different than a dog showing it towards unknown/new dogs. There are two types of aggression (none of which that can be diagnosed over the internet, but just for the sake of the discussion) - fear aggression is the most common type of aggression we see in dogs, probably about 90-95% of aggressive dogs are fear aggressive. FA is when a dog is under confident and we generally see the dog exhibiting aggression to dogs or people that it doesn't know. The second and more uncommon type of aggression seen in dogs is rank aggression. This is when a dog is over confident and most often aggresses towards dogs and people that are known to the dog. In Sakora's case it is most likely that she showed subtle signs of the behaviour over time, but these are often signs and cues that we can miss easily if we don't know what to look out for. It could be rank aggression, and she has become over confident around other dogs, or it could be fear based aggression where other dogs make her uncomfortable. Or it could be the other dog too - sometimes what we view as one dog being the primary aggressor can actually be the other way around, and the dog on the receiving end was actually the instigator but was just more subtle in it's behaviour. One thing that I can say for sure is that if the behaviour is not handled and diagnosed appropriately, it can definitely escalate. Aggression can be very rewarding for dogs if they learn that it is a way to win and because it gives them an adrenaline rush that releases endorphins into their brains - so they can often get a chemical reward for exhibiting aggression. It's definitely a complex problem and we often benefit from guidance from someone experienced in dealing with aggressive behaviour in dogs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siberian_wolf Posted April 6, 2009 Report Share Posted April 6, 2009 Just to help me clarify it my own mind.............. when you say rank aggressive I assume you mean dominance aggression? http://www.petplace.com/dogs/dominance-aggression/page1.aspx was just browsing search sites seeing if i could find anything - this was the closest match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Austinville Posted April 6, 2009 Report Share Posted April 6, 2009 Since dogs are excellent at disguising pain, I would consider a vet check. Bo once acted similarly, seemingly without reason. A trip to the vet, meds for an ear infection, and a little patience were quick to reverse his odd actions to normal again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bec Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Just to help me clarify it my own mind.............. when you say rank aggressive I assume you mean dominance aggression? http://www.petplace.com/dogs/dominance-aggression/page1.aspx was just browsing search sites seeing if i could find anything - this was the closest match. Rank aggression is the term I have been taught, but other trainers may call it dominance aggression It's essentially the same thing, you are working with an over confident, dominant dog. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siberian_wolf Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Rank aggression is the term I have been taught, but other trainers may call it dominance aggression It's essentially the same thing, you are working with an over confident, dominant dog. thats ok then, just wondering. Not heard it been called rank aggression before that all. Now I know I have something else to start learning about Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sakora Posted April 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Thank- you all for the great advice, I made an appointment with her vet(he's know her longer than I have) and she's in great health, We are going to talk to a behaviorist ,I'm waiting to hear back from him, The vet also said that he thinks that Sakora might be acting out cause she kinda laying her claim on me so to speak! Maybe getting a little to over confident( he told me that when she was with the other people she was very timid, and fearful of her surroundings) and when he saw her come in with me this time she seems to have done a 360, Also I take Sakora with me everywhere so mabey I'm treating her too much as my equal, I dont know we will see what the behaviorist has to say, AS for now she seems to be in better spirits shes back to eating, And we saw echo on a walk yesterday and she tried dragging me over to see him, I haven't brought the rottie over cause I think that's also what was contributing to some of her behavioral problems, so will keep you posterd if the problem persists and will tell you all what behaviorist says too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bec Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Sounds great Sakora, relieved to hear the vet gave her the all clear! Let us know how it goes with the behaviourist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siberian_wolf Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Thank- you all for the great advice, I made an appointment with her vet(he's know her longer than I have) and she's in great health, We are going to talk to a behaviorist ,I'm waiting to hear back from him, The vet also said that he thinks that Sakora might be acting out cause she kinda laying her claim on me so to speak! Maybe getting a little to over confident( he told me that when she was with the other people she was very timid, and fearful of her surroundings) and when he saw her come in with me this time she seems to have done a 360, Also I take Sakora with me everywhere so mabey I'm treating her too much as my equal, I dont know we will see what the behaviorist has to say, AS for now she seems to be in better spirits shes back to eating, And we saw echo on a walk yesterday and she tried dragging me over to see him, I haven't brought the rottie over cause I think that's also what was contributing to some of her behavioral problems, so will keep you posterd if the problem persists and will tell you all what behaviorist says too Glad she had the all clear from the vets you have a good vet there, honest and tries to help you in all fields whether its their speciality or not! Good luck with the behaviourist, please keep us updated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarah Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 good luck with everything let us know how you get on xx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BingBlaze n Skyla Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 good luck wit her keep us posted! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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