James Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Going by that logic though, half the breeds we know and love today wouldn't be around. Then again when Sibes were first becoming popular as household pets they started to also develop serious health problems due to inbreeding to keep the breed pedigree. So it can work both ways... Just because A breed was bred for x reason in the beggining, doesn't mean it can't be used for anything else. I guess I'm sensative on the subject, because a) Kita is a husky X NI, to many times I've seen people look down on dogs due to the fact their not pedigree. Anyway we're really starting to de-rail the thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raindog Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Going by that logic though, half the breeds we know and love today wouldn't be around. In the past most breeds were created for a purpose. Sled dogs, herding dogs, livestock protection dogs, lap dogs, hunting dogs, retrievers etc etc. The only modern dog breed I can think of that was created (in part) for a "look" was the Leonberger, but the Leonberger has many other characteristics - carting, water rescue etc etc as well as its "lion like" looks. In order to get crossbreeds to eventually breed true and become a "Breed" which will reproduce itself time and time again, it takes many many generations. In the past, the pups which didn't make the grade were simply shot, drowned or starved. Here in the 21st Century UK, we have over 200 KC recognised breeds to choose from and "culling" puppies is no longer socially acceptable. As a result, anyone who is trying to create a new breed ends up flooding the market with crossbreed puppies (as if there aren't enough already). Then again when Sibes were first becoming popular as household pets they started to also develop serious health problems due to inbreeding to keep the breed pedigree. So it can work both ways... This is, in fact, the very opposite of the truth. When sibes became popular, it was the indiscriminate breeding of non-health tested parents by idiot breeders just out to make some easy cash, which gave rise to an increase in health problems within the breed. In fact, it would also be untrue to suggest that the Siberian Husky as a breed now has "serious health problems" - despite the massive increase in numbers of Siberians, the breed is still one of the healthiest there is, and considering that every single Siberian Husky in the world goes back to about 12 entire dogs and bitches imported to Alaska in the early years of the 20th Century, in-breeding doesn't seem to have affected the breed too much. Just because A breed was bred for x reason in the beggining, doesn't mean it can't be used for anything else. Of course! Some breeds were fighting dogs, others were war dogs - their original purposes are now considered unacceptable and they have been trained nowadays for other purposes. Mick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anne Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 James we all have our own opinions on this thread mine is personaly if they have tried for years to fix health problems in dogs why start mixing the breeds now and causing more health problems thats just my opinion , I personaly dont treat any dog any different because of their pedigree in fact neither of mine are registered dosnt mean I love them any less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BingBlaze n Skyla Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Going by that logic though, half the breeds we know and love today wouldn't be around. think of it as if that was the case thousands of dogs wouldnt be in rescues and end up being pts everyday just because theres too many to be homed - it wouldnt be such a bad thing imo ETA: i also agree with the above - i have a mutt he is my very first ever dog and i love him to bits! hes my baby - and i would rescue another x breed if i ever get the chance HOWEVER i wouldnt pay money (apart from a donation / adoption fee) for a x breed as i feel its kind of a rip off - but doesnt mean i dont love my x breed to bits i would have paid the world for him if i had to to save him from his past but most people breed x breeds JUST to make money Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staceybob Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 I dont think anyone is particularly looking down on the nortern inuit but more questioning what it was bred for. Huskies were bred for pulling. Northern Inuits were bred to look like wolves. That's not saying Northern Inuits are incapable of working for us, but if you look into the people that started to breed Northern Inuits, they all say they were breeding them to try and get a domesticated dog that looked like a wolf, which in most peoples opinions, isn't a good enough reason to try and create a new breed. Stacey xxx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 think of it as if that was the case thousands of dogs wouldnt be in rescues and end up being pts everyday just because theres too many to be homed - it wouldnt be such a bad thing imo ETA: i also agree with the above - i have a mutt he is my very first ever dog and i love him to bits! hes my baby - and i would rescue another x breed if i ever get the chance HOWEVER i wouldnt pay money (apart from a donation / adoption fee) for a x breed as i feel its kind of a rip off - but doesnt mean i dont love my x breed to bits i would have paid the world for him if i had to to save him from his past but most people breed x breeds JUST to make money Well I'm sorry that just shows you do infact think less of an X breed dog, You would pay for a pedigree, but not an X Breed. It makes me sad to think the look or personality of the dog makes no difference, That because they are an X they are a "rip off". People breeed X breeds just to make money, well breeders breed pedigree dogs to make money, Its all the same. Just because breeders breed x breeds doesn't mean the dogs are treated any worse. If you wanted a pure Siberian because you were a sled racer or needed them for expedition, I would understand. But when you are looking for a loving companion, Why should it matter if its X or not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BingBlaze n Skyla Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Well I'm sorry that just shows you do infact think less of an X breed dog, You would pay for a pedigree, but not an X Breed. It makes me sad to think the look or personality of the dog makes no difference, That because they are an X they are a "rip off". People breeed X breeds just to make money, well breeders breed pedigree dogs to make money, Its all the same. Just because breeders breed x breeds doesn't mean the dogs are treated any worse. If you wanted a pure Siberian because you were a sled racer or needed them for expedition, I would understand. But when you are looking for a loving companion, Why should it matter if its X or not? i own a x breed - like i said he is my first ever dog and i ADORE him - anybody who knows me and knows bingo and knows the bond we have knows how much we love each other - he is my shadow - i also only paid for one of my pure breed huskies too - the other was a rehome at 14 weeks old - what im saying is i wouldnt pay £500+ for a mutt when i can get a mutt from a rescue and give it a good loving home and spend the extra £400-odd on treating that dog to a good life - breeders breed pedigrees to better the breed not to make money - as most people who breed dogs properly hardly or never make any profit on their litters. ETA: i also think Bings my mutt is one of the most gorgeous dogs i have ever known (and im not just saying that because he is my baby) i know plenty of x breeds who are all ABSOLUTELY STUNNING and ive fallen in love with them so where in my comments do i seem to think less of a x breed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staceybob Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Its not about hating crossbreeds it is about remembering that if we continue to pay for them - they will be bred more and more, which is encouraging potentially bad breeding to occur. Yes bad breeding occurs in pedigrees, but whos to say what could happen if you kept breeding random breeds together, they could be very deformed. Stacey xxx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 i own a x breed - like i said he is my first ever dog and i ADORE him - anybody who knows me and knows bingo and knows the bond we have knows how much we love each other - he is my shadow - i also only paid for one of my pure breed huskies too - the other was a rehome at 14 weeks old - what im saying is i wouldnt pay £500+ for a mutt when i can get a mutt from a rescue and give it a good loving home and spend the extra £400-odd on treating that dog to a good life - breeders breed pedigrees to better the breed not to make money - as most people who breed dogs properly hardly or never make any profit on their litters. I'm not in any way suggesting you don't love bing any less than your huskies, But as you said paying for a mutt is a "rip off" which has tbh offended me. But of course you're entitled to your opinion. I payed for Kita, I Knew I wanted a husky type dog, So i looked around, I was indiscriminate though, I couldn't care if they were X or not. I saw the breeders and if I were confident they were good people and looked after their dogs, But the main thing was the connection between me and the dog. Of course I would have loved to rescue, but unfortunatley there were not husky type dogs available for rescue in my area. There will be good breeders of pedigree and X Breeds, same as there will be bad of both. I think I'll leave this threat alone now tbh, I'm just not getting a good Vibe from it. This is all totally off topic and should be saved for another thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BingBlaze n Skyla Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 i belive paying stupid amounts of money for a x breed is a rip off - ive just done a search for 'labradoodle' puppies for sale and they are being sold for £500 all the way up to £1200! how is that NOT a rip off? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sutsibe Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Well I'm sorry that just shows you do infact think less of an X breed dog, You would pay for a pedigree, but not an X Breed. It makes me sad to think the look or personality of the dog makes no difference, That because they are an X they are a "rip off". People breeed X breeds just to make money, well breeders breed pedigree dogs to make money, Its all the same. Just because breeders breed x breeds doesn't mean the dogs are treated any worse. If you wanted a pure Siberian because you were a sled racer or needed them for expedition, I would understand. But when you are looking for a loving companion, Why should it matter if its X or not? I have been a breeder of pure-bred Siberians for over 20 years, and I, too, object to using them to make "designer dogs". I don't mind quite as much when racing people use Siberians to cross with Alaskan Huskies for their racing programs, as I understand what they're trying to do. Alaskan Huskies will never truly be more than a cross-breed, however, as long as people keep adding Siberians or other breeds into the mix, and simply breed Alaskan to Alaskan. The pedigree IS important - it shows who the ancestors are, and if you know those dogs - either personally or by reputation, have a pretty good idea how that dog is likely to look and act. I can look at American pedigrees over several decades, and depending on where they're from (I've known more dogs from the eastern half of the US than the West), will know something about many of the dogs in it. This makes it easier to make predictions of what genes are likely to show up in the offspring. A pedigree is only worth the breeder who wrote it, however. I agree with Mick - when people start mixing dog breeds to create a specific look, a "designer dog", they generally get into it solely for the money, and ethics tend to go out the window. Reputable breeders will breed for a purpose that involves the benefit (and hand in glove with that, the health 0f) the breed. If a dog bred for show or racing purposes (and there are pet puppies from those litters, as well) isn't genetically healthy, it won't perform/compete well. It's for this reason that we strongly advocate buying from reputable breeders who will do appropriate genetic tests and breed from healthy stock - and who love the breed enough to breed for that love, not the money. Very few reputable breeders truly make money on their puppies - it all gets put back into the dogs, and into "proving" them as superior genetic stock in the show ring or on the trail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staceybob Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 I was indiscriminate though, I couldn't care if they were X or not. I saw the breeders and if I were confident they were good people and looked after their dogs, But the main thing was the connection between me and the dog. No one is discriminating against cross breeds but you should care if they are crossed or not. What if your pup had a severe back problem from being badly crossed? If you have a healthy cross breed then thats great. No one is saying you cant have a great connection with them because they are crossed, but cross breeding should be done with great care. Stacey xxx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 i belive paying stupid amounts of money for a x breed is a rip off - ive just done a search for 'labradoodle puppies for sale' and they are being sold for £500 all the way up to £1200! how is that NOT a rip off? But a Pure Labrador or poodle would be fine at that price? Or would they still be a rip off? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SarahNukka&Shadow Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 I'm not in any way suggesting you don't love bing any less than your huskies, But as you said paying for a mutt is a "rip off" which has tbh offended me. But of course you're entitled to your opinion. I payed for Kita, I Knew I wanted a husky type dog, So i looked around, I was indiscriminate though, I couldn't care if they were X or not. I saw the breeders and if I were confident they were good people and looked after their dogs, But the main thing was the connection between me and the dog. Of course I would have loved to rescue, but unfortunatley there were not husky type dogs available for rescue in my area. There will be good breeders of pedigree and X Breeds, same as there will be bad of both. I think I'll leave this threat alone now tbh, I'm just not getting a good Vibe from it. This is all totally off topic and should be saved for another thread. Not wanting anywhere near in on this "discussion" but I just wanted to say.. not enough rescue huskies in your area is very very not true, maybe not in shelters but if you contact SHCGB, SHWA(UK) or Huskies in need all of them have huskies in need of homes in all areas of the country and are full to bursting needing good homes!! Please look more carfully when your looking for your next husky or husky type there are hundreds in rescue!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loops Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 I think I'll leave this threat alone now tbh, I'm just not getting a good Vibe from it. This is all totally off topic and should be saved for another thread. aww bless .theres no need to spit the dummy. this thread has got out of context and confused because the majority of people cant see the point in creating potentially lary dogs ie when a wild wolf is used to sire, when there are "safer" options readily and legally available. I am not a dog snob but like bing/blaze/skyla i would not pay hundreds for a cross. Likewise i probably wouldnt pay hundreds for any other type of dog.. I chose a husky because we walk and camp up mountains and while most dogs can walk up a mountain, they cant sleep up there in a blizzard in december, jan and feb, which has happened to us before, the bird was just curled up uncer the snow not a problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee&Falks Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 But a Pure Labrador or poodle would be fine at that price? Or would they still be a rip off? No Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BingBlaze n Skyla Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 But a Pure Labrador or poodle would be fine at that price? Or would they still be a rip off? most labradors and poodles ive just searched for are going for £500 a few slightly over but not many (tho im finding it hard to find pure bred poodle pups atm they are all chipoos and jackapoos ect URGH - so imo thats fine so long as they have had all the health tests eye checks hip scores done ect and are registered as i doubt very much all these xpoos have been health tested - people give them a fancy name and slap a stupidly expensive price tag on them and people fall for that - ill bet most xpoos do not have health tests done n why pay upto £1200 for a dog who could have health problems Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sutsibe Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 But a Pure Labrador or poodle would be fine at that price? Or would they still be a rip off? I don't know what the "going" price for a Lab or Poodle from a reputable breeder in that area is, but if that was so (and it might be for a dog that was from top-performing parents and meant to do the same), yes. If the dog in question was from someone who did not health check or prove their breeding stock - no way! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 While I agree that if I saw a Lab for 500 or a poddle for 500 and a Labradoodle for say a £1000, then I would agree with you that it would be a ripoff. But only because in my opinion the labradoodle should cost the same as the other 2. While I do agree that NIs being bred in the 1st place purely for look, isn't exactly a good reason to create the breed, But the fact of the matter is they are here now and I hate the idea that people look down on them because of their herritage and I do get the feeling that is going on here. I'm sure Northern Inuits will prove there worth in something, Apparently they do make good sled dogs and hopefully gain a reptuable herritage. Either way I love the breed, everyone I've met has been amazing, wonderful temprement and personality! I for one am glad the breeed exists whatever the reason may be that it does. At the end of the day I'll have to agree to disagree with all of you on this subject (and boy did I get ganged up on ). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loops Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 did anyone see the bullshitz on britains got talent.. only watched it cos step daughter was here! lol to cross a british bulldog with a shitzu primarily to call it a bullshiz is wrong! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BingBlaze n Skyla Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 did anyone see the bullshitz on britains got talent.. only watched it cos step daughter was here! lol to cross a british bulldog with a shitzu primarily to call it a bullshiz is wrong! yes i saw that his mohawk was awesome but my god he wasnt the prettiest dog was he lol bless him james NO1 is looking down on NIs or other x breeds at all this forum has ALOT of x breed dogs on here and all are welcome! people have different opinions on x breeds ect and mine is i wouldnt pay upto a grand for a x breed when i can rescue 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SarahNukka&Shadow Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 While I do agree that NIs being bred in the 1st place purely for look, isn't exactly a good reason to create the breed, But the fact of the matter is they are here now and I hate the idea that people look down on them because of their herritage and I do get the feeling that is going on here. I'm sure Northern Inuits will prove there worth in something, Apparently they do make good sled dogs and hopefully gain a reptuable herritage. Either way I love the breed, everyone I've met has been amazing, wonderful temprement and personality! I for one am glad the breeed exists whatever the reason may be that it does. At the end of the day I'll have to agree to disagree with all of you on this subject (and boy did I get ganged up on ). James I think you are missing peoples points entirely... we LOVE dogs! All dogs! Doesnt matter what breed they are or what cross breed or even where they came from! We here all love them and do not look down on any of them in any way...... The people who breed them for every penny they can get out of them, THOSE are the ones we are looking down on!!! The back yard breeders and puppy farmers breeding dogs left and right without any thought other than how much money they will get for them on gumtree and preloved!! And the fact remains that while they continue to breed them and give them names that sound lagit people will continue to pay rediculous sums of money for them, so the vicious cycle continues! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewbacca_&_me Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Im with u on this nix, I would rather rescue. I have actually lol, kiya is a sweet wolf mix girl but Id have said no if Id have been asked to pay alot of money to take her....it would have killed me to walk away lol but I would have. To be honest I think wolf/husky mix is prob fine so long as the owner works with the dog from day 1- no excuses and no laziness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Not wanting anywhere near in on this "discussion" but I just wanted to say.. not enough rescue huskies in your area is very very not true, maybe not in shelters but if you contact SHCGB, SHWA(UK) or Huskies in need all of them have huskies in need of homes in all areas of the country and are full to bursting needing good homes!! Please look more carfully when your looking for your next husky or husky type there are hundreds in rescue!!! well now I feel irresponsible. I will defintley look harder next time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 James I think you are missing peoples points entirely... we LOVE dogs! All dogs! Doesnt matter what breed they are or what cross breed or even where they came from! We here all love them and do not look down on any of them in any way...... The people who breed them for every penny they can get out of them, THOSE are the ones we are looking down on!!! The back yard breeders and puppy farmers breeding dogs left and right without any thought other than how much money they will get for them on gumtree and preloved!! And the fact remains that while they continue to breed them and give them names that sound lagit people will continue to pay rediculous sums of money for them, so the vicious cycle continues! No I know, Maybe its just the mood i'm in, But I just got that Vibe, Maybe I'm just being over protective of Kita ^_^ I don't know. Just In case anyone think I did ..... I didn't pay a ridiculous sum of money for Kita because she had northern Inuit in her (well I didnt pay a ridiculos sum of money for her at all... not that it matters). Sorry If have offended anyone, and sorry if I lumped you in with the "Pedigree makes my dog better than yours" crew, Just a touchy subject I suppose and my old family dog Jenny X breed got a hard time for not being a Collie X (she was rescue). So I was probably Over defensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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